Frage zu Ledger-Flüchtlingen

[root_s2yse8vt]

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Habe inmitten der Ledger-Panik ein Model T bestellt. Ich werde die bitcoin nur Firmware zu installieren; und dann “Übertragung” von btc von meinem Ledger Wallet. Da ich nicht weiß, wie groß mein Seed-Phrase ist, weiß ich, dass es eine gute Idee wäre, eine neue zu erstellen, wenn ich meinen Trezor bekomme. ABER ich habe mir meine 24-Wort-Seed-Phrase gemerkt und würde sie gerne behalten.

Meine Frage ist: Wenn ich die 24-Wort-Seed-Phrase wiederverwende, aber eine neue passphrase-geschützte Wallet erstelle und den Großteil meiner btc dorthin verschiebe, wäre das ausreichend sicher.

Folgefrage… Ich bin mir der Anfälligkeit der Trezors für physische Hacks bewusst. Kann man trotzdem davon ausgehen, dass eine passphrase-geschützte Wallet (25. Wort) vor solchen Angriffen sicher ist?

[Dukaduke22]

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If you re use your 24 word seed phrase and it’s compromised then your pass phrase is your main way of keeping things secured. How secure it is at that point is a function of what kind of pass phrase. It needs to be a very strong pass phrase. I would just create a new seed phrase. It’s not that big of a deal.

[John_Pig]

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Do things right, create a new seed and passphrase. I would also advice against memorizing it, but that’s you. To my knowledge, at this time there are no hardware liabilities, please, link to what you know.

[marvinrabbit]

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A little off topic question: Is the memorization the ONLY backup of your seed? **IF** so, I’d really recommend against that. I got a brain tumor and spent 35 days in the hospital. When I got home, I had NO IDEA what the password was to my password vault, and I typed that 20 times a day! It’s easy for something to happen to *make* you forget, no matter your skill at memory castles or other things.

I know you didn’t say it was your only way of backup. So this may not apply to your situation.

[senlek]

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Thanks for everyone’s thoughts. I received my Model T yesterday and “recovered” my original 24 word seed phrase. I could change to a new seed phrase later if I thought it was necessary; but as things stand now I think Ledger has not compromised it.

The fact that I have it memorized was a big factor in the decision. I do have physical backup of course… just paper, but in a fire-proof safe . Also I have had most of my btc on a passphrase-protected wallet “on” the Ledger device. I will gradually move the bulk of that to a new passphrase-protected account on my Trezor. I am also awaiting delivery of a Blockstream Jade wallet. If it arrives then I will create yet another passphrase wallet on it, and move a portion of my coins there. So I will have some diversification.

I will keep a small amount in the original 24 word wallet. If it disappears then I can shuffle all funds from the passphrase wallets to a completely new wallet with a new seed phrase.

I’m an old guy trying to keep things simple. Having the seed phrase memorized seems like a good thing to me. When I set up the Trezor I wrote the words on a piece of paper from memory and got it right. I know it has risks; but I like the fact that I can get on a plane and land anywhere, buy a wallet and have access to my coins. And, at my age, a brain tumor would most likely be game over.

[bullett007]

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Although I think you’d be fine. You’ll always have a seed of doubt in your mind that your seed is somehow compromised, which ironically is caused by the closed source nature of Ledger.

Perhaps, creating a wallet with 12-words is the way forward, shorter and easier to memorise over time but still offers practically the same level of protection.

[Neeuw]

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That’s an interesting idea!

You could just recover your seed phrase and add an passphrase on top of it. Since that creates a whole new set of accounts you would have to move your stack on chain.
With the Model T you can swipe the type screens and use small fonts, caps and specials signs.

Yes, since the passphare is not stored on the device it would protect you from a 5 dollar wrench attach or physical hack of the device.

[iciEric]

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Segregated wallets allow us to NOT rely on a single brand… without having to mess around with too many recovery backups.

Take a look at the relationship between BIP39 and BIP85. You can retrieve all your child seeds based on your master seed phrase. You can use passphrase as well.

AirGap Vault (BIP85): https://youtu.be/JVuURYQkhxg and https://support.airgap.it/guides/bip85/

Coldcard (BIP85): https://bip85.com/ and https://youtu.be/cRRB_WzZpTM

Jade (BIP85): https://help.blockstream.com/hc/en-us/articles/15844055048857-How-do-I-generate-a-child-recovery-phrase-using-BIP85-

SeedSigner (BIP85): https://seedsigner.com/ Release 0.6.0 = https://github.com/SeedSigner/seedsigner/releases/

The page of the BIP39 Tool of Ian Coleman saved on a USB Drive with Tails offline: https://iancoleman.io/bip39/ then check the box “Show BIP85” + https://tails.boum.org/install/download/index.en.html

[Spragclutcher]

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Yes, that would work! Chances are that your Ledger 24 seed word has not been compromised (although we can’t know due to Ledger Close Source).

Adding a pass phrase would protect your funds if your Ledger seed phrase was compromised.

What you can do is recover on your Trezor T, your original 24 word Ledger wallet. Create a hidden wallet by adding a strong passphrase to it. Send most but not all of your original Ledger wallet BTC to the new hidden passphrase protected wallet (Leave a small amount of BTC in your original wallet).

By monitoring the small amount of BTC in your original wallet (just your 24 word Ledger wallet) you will be able to tell if your 24 word seed phrase has been compromised if the small amount of BTC left in it suddenly disappears. Your main funds in your connected hidden passphrase wallet will still be safe due to the passphrase, but you can nevertheless move them to a totally new and fully un-compromised wallet.

[random_user7980]

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Passphrase is safe from physical attacks, since passphrases isn’t stored on the device.
I’d create new seeds. Trezor T has 12 words, which are easy to memorize.
12 words + passphrase and you’re good to go.

[Autor]

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